[MPlayer-dev-eng] Commit rules and coexistence rules

[Michael Niedermayer]

On Fri, Jun 06, 2008 at 05:52:00PM +0200, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 06, 2008 at 02:58:52AM +0200, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 06, 2008 at 02:09:50AM +0200, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> > > On Thu, Jun 05, 2008 at 11:52:51PM +0200, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
> > > > On Thu, Jun 05, 2008 at 04:35:35PM +0200, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> > > > > On Thu, Jun 05, 2008 at 02:29:36PM +0200, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
> > > > > > On Thu, Jun 05, 2008 at 10:45:17AM +0200, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> > > > [...]
> > > > > > > IMNSHO the active developers should be the ones running the show.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > The project is "run" by our docs maintainer who is not a developer at all.
> > > > > > If you suggest to step back and let reimar & evgeny & ben & luca take over
> > > > > > root i would support this.
> > > > > > But that wont happen, you will never step back and let the people who
> > > > > > actally write the code have the reins. You just use devel activity as
> > > > > > argument when it serves your goals ...
> > > > > 
> > > > > False.  I am the one who wants to have the people who actually write the
> > > > > code have the reins, not you.
> > > > 
> > > > i did not want to reply, but this statement feels too insulting to let it
> > > > stand
> > > > i know better than you what i want. And i would be happy to see the
> > > > active developers have the reins.
> > > 
> > > The active developers have voted and do not share your opinion.
> > 
> > many active developers have not voted,
> 
> This is interesting: First you want me to revoke an account without
> any votes from active developers, now you claim that not enough active
> developers have voted.  What's it going to be?

As you already misquote me, why not also misquote some awnsers as well?
I cant awnser your question because its based on false assumtation about
what i said.


> 
> > You are an invaluable member of the mplayer team
> 
> I thought I had just heard you say my contributions were worthless.

Must be a bug in the speech synthization software then, maybe you should
just normally read my mails.


> Well, I'm glad that you have reconsidered.

I have not, you twist what i said as it fits best in your political
agenda.

Let me say it again.
* You are not a C developer
* You are invaluable, one only has to look at all the commits you did
  to know why
* The leader(s) of a project based on C should be experienced C developer(s).


[...]

> > I for one would love to see a leader beliving in democracy
> > for example ...
> 
> What sort of democracy are you looking for?

>  Your idea of democracy
> seems to be 

no, i can speak for myself

democracy means that the decissions are done by the people,
here decissions about C code should be done by the C developers.
Be that through a vote after discussions or otherwise.


> starting to vote away at random in some dark corner, insist
> on head count to generate legitimacy and when the vote is tied by head
> count, disregard the outcome and flame as if there was no tomorrow.
> 

> I am not in any way opposed to democracy in general, but I do not
> subscribe to your ideas about voting procedures at all.
> Democracy needs a constitution and proper voting procedures.
> 
> Also, I do not believe in voting as an adequate means of resolving
> conflicts in projects like this one.  Plus, I do not think that head
> count is an appropriate measure in all situations.

Well and i do not think your head counts infinity while everyone actually
affected by the decission counts 0. Also one has to decide about the voting
procedure before the vote. When we spoke years ago you suggested that
mplayer should be lead by a team containing at least reimar&roberto&you
but now as roberto disagreed he is "inactive" and should better not be
counted. He wasnt active back then either.


> 
> > > > You have the highest raw commit count but the lowest of self written C code.
> > > 
> > > This project does not consist just of C code. 
> > 
> > No, but if you take everything else away, mplayer can still be used (a little
> > annoying to compile files without a build system but it can be done).
> 
> It would obviously be of little use to developers who would have to
> implement some sort of build system from scratch.  configure and the
> Makefiles together currently weigh in at about 10000 [1] lines of code.
> This is entirely nontrivial.

and i claim i could compile most of mplayer with a simple
for i in *.c ; do gcc ...

It wont do dependancies and of course i would have to edit a template of
config.h first to match my system but i certainly wont have to write
10k lines of anything


> 
> It would be of absolutely no use to users, who would know neither how to
> build it, nor how to make any use of it without documentation.
> 

> It would be hard to get without a website or a project server.

The project server is not your private property


> 
> > If you take the C code away there is nothing left one could use
> 
> If I take the C code from the inactive developers away, MPlayer remains
> practically unchanged.

that shows nicely how much you know about the C code
if you take arpis code away theres nothing left.
If you take mine away you loose many video filters, swscale, postprocessing
ffmpeg, optimizations in liba52, some audio filters, ...
And no uoti is not the author of something because he reindented it or moved
a few globals into a struct. I can revert all of uotis commits and likely
would never notice that something is missing.
MPlayer was very useable before uoti, it did not exist before arpi.


> 
> > > Still my commit count to
> > > C files exceeds that of the 5 people who voted against Uoti.
> > 
> > But none of this code is written by you. Nor has any of it been reviewed by you
> 
> False.

reindentions and spelling fixes dont count as written or reviewed C code ...

[...]
-- 
Michael     GnuPG fingerprint: 9FF2128B147EF6730BADF133611EC787040B0FAB

It is not what we do, but why we do it that matters.
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 189 bytes
Desc: Digital signature
URL: <http://lists.mplayerhq.hu/pipermail/mplayer-dev-eng/attachments/20080606/f23ed0c5/attachment.pgp>