[FFmpeg-devel] MPlayer changes discussed on FFmpeg mailing lists

[Diego Biurrun]

On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 04:40:45PM +0100, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 01:23:36PM +0100, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 01:33:06AM +0100, Michael Niedermayer wrote:
> > > On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 06:37:54PM +0100, Diego Biurrun wrote:
> > > > Recent events make me think a general statement is in order.
> > > > 
> > > > FFmpeg and MPlayer have always been closely related and many devs are
> > > > shared even though the relationship is no longer quite as close as it
> > > > used to be.
> > > > 
> > > > Some of the FFmpeg committers are MPlayer committers as well.  However,
> > > > the FFmpeg mailing lists are not the MPlayer mailing lists.  MPlayer
> > > > changes *must* be discussed on the MPlayer mailing lists before being
> > > > executed.  Relying on MPlayer developers to follow FFmpeg mailing lists
> > > > in order to be notified about changes to MPlayer is unacceptable.  It
> > > > also does not work in practice as we just witnessed.
> > > > 
> > > > Also note that such behavior is a clear violation of MPlayer project
> > > > policy (?5, ?9, ?12).  In the past I have been direly criticized for
> > > > not closing accounts due to perceived policy changes.  Please avoid
> > > > putting me in a situation where my only option is closing accounts.
> > > 
> > > Please accept my appology in the name of all people involved in this
> > > 
> > > We should have CC-ed mplayer-dev, noone did.
> > > I repeat my and carls offer to revert the change, it is no major problem at all
> > > to keep the tabs in libmpcodecs and keep or remove them from
> > > libavfilter/libmpcodecs independantly, if the mplayer developers prefer this.
> > > 
> > > Also as you are making a general statement about the policy, let me make one
> > > too. what you say that "my only option is closing accounts"
> > > really you can "send a mail", "call us on the phone, hell you have my and i bet
> > > carls number", closing accounts is the thing that is done when other options
> > > fail.
> > 
> > Funny that you never got that memo yourself.  To this day, you have not
> > initiated a single phone call yourself, not even an IRC chat.  Surely
> 
> Thats quite untrue, i very definitly called attila a not that long while ago
> That said iam neither fan of phone calls nor irc. Which is why i use email
> instead of these other methods of communication when possible.

Yes, true, you have initiated a single phone call in more or less all
your life.  No further comment.

> > Also funny that you don't remember how many times I picked up the phone
> > or got into private conversations with clashing parties in order to
> > defuse conflicts.
> 
> I remember you fusing and detonating the uoti conflict with your phone calls
> and in the process made the mplayer project look really bad for ignoring a
> 2/3 majority in a vote.
> Not to mention there where people that where quite upset about you using phone
> calls after a vote that did not pass like you thought it would have been better

You continue telling your twisted version of the story.  I mediated a
resolution of the problems between Reimar and Uoti and later I mediated
a compromise that *you* agreed to explicitly.  Otherwise MPlayer would
have been forked.  Now you pretend you never agreed and keep accusing
me.  Give it a break already, it was your compromise as well, you're
an adult, don't give me the responsibility for your actions.  If you
feel you made a mistake, fine, but don't blame me for your mistakes,
you made them of your own volition.

And please close this neverending topic already, it will not go anywhere,
ever.

> Also even at the risk that you dont like it, i must point out that at the least
> this commit cannot have been a genuine surprise to you as i did send you a mail
> days before it in which i requested the tab check script to be disabled for the
> involved directories in ffmpeg. Ive send it long before any consensus about if
> such changes would be needed at all because i did not expect you to make this
> change quickly if at all.
> After seeing that email you must have realized we would remove the tabs
> before commit somewhere instead of stoping development if you would not react.

False:

email date:

  Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 13:08:35 +0100
  From: Michael Niedermayer <michaelni at gmx.at>
  To: Diego Biurrun <diego at biurrun.de>
  Subject: libmpcodecs in libavfilter needs SVN tab/trail check to be amended
  Message-id: <20110114120835.GB16181 at kiste2>

commit date:

  r32789 | cehoyos | 2011-01-14 23:10:21 +0100 (Fri, 14 Jan 2011) | 1 line

That gives me a full 10 hours, not the "days" you speak of, at a time
where I am continually very busy and don't respond to email as quick as
I usually do, something that you all were very well aware of.

> I think my appology to the mplayer developers is genuine and honest, but you
> maybe interpreted it to be an apology only to you personally, that i had not
> meant by writing it.

Oh, that does indeed clear things up.

> I feel your complaint here is a bit out of proportion which is why i tried to
> put it into perspective, it was maybe unwise from me to put this into the same
> email on the same day still i did. Iam not a diplomat...

No comment.

Diego