[MPlayer-users] Re: [expert] NVidia will be bannished

Nick Kurshev nickols_k at mail.ru
Thu Jan 31 08:49:29 CET 2002

Hello, Jan!

On Wed, 30 Jan 2002 10:05:36 -0700 you wrote:

> [Automatic answer: RTFM (read DOCS, FAQ), also read DOCS/bugreports.html]
> On Wed, Jan 30, 2002 at 10:56:29AM +0300, Nick Kurshev wrote:
> @>> @>PPC always was closed platform and as result its place on the market is less
> @>> @>of 15% agains of open, expandable IBM's platform. (Even if PPC is faster of Intel's cpus)
> @>> 
> @>> Don't fool yourself into thinking ideology won the day. Apple made
> @>> some brutal decisions in its past, and they paid for them, but most of
> @>> them were related to marketing and business, not ideology.
> @>> 
> @>I'm not interesting in causes of that. I know that Apple did
> unexpandable platform first!
> You said: PPC always was closed platform and *as result* its place on
> the market is less of 15% agains of open, expandable IBM's
> platform. (Emphasis mine.)
> I'm saying, that's not true. It isn't. Apple has lost market share due
> to blunders on their own part. In any case, that's not true, as
> someone else has also pointed out. PPC has always been an open
> platform, but nobody wanted to build them.
If I will have money to purchase expensive processor then I would prefer
to spend them for Sun ultrasparc or for DecAlpha or for Babayan's Elbrus-2000
at end but not for PPC anyway.
PPC is expensive semisolution, imho.

> @>Do you want to use proprietary closed driver and software? Use it.
> @>I prefer use open schemes. Maybe Nvidia does right things. But I never
> @>purchase its chips. It looks the same as closed documentation for
> @>Intel cpus for expample ;) Could you imagine self that every programmer
> @>uses Intel C/C++ without alternative?
> @>You will be wait until NVidia will implement something that's good for you.
> @>But I'm going too implement HW postprocessing for radeons! (That is mplayer specific
> @>and will never be implement by NVidia). What is better? Think it again please.
> Despite nvidia's own implementation of their driver, they aren't
> preventing you or anyone else from developing extra software for their
> card.
Is it joke? Maybe you mean - they don't mind? :)
And how do you imaging self this process?
If nobody has their documentation then how it could be done?
By hacking of w2k's dlls or you know other ways?

> In any case (and I mean NO offense), it's almost certainly the
> case that their product will be of higher quality no matter how much
> documentation ATi gives you.
I have no documentation from ATI ;) But internet has a lots of sources
and its enough for me and for everyone to implement everything.
Question like NVidia is better of ATI not for this mailing list!
But if you want to know - I guess that it biggest gift of destiny
that there is ATI. Else your worshiped NVidia could become by monopolist
like M$. Only ATI with their TRUEFORM technology could stop their
dictate in prices. ATI has done first step towards photorealistics
games and this fact had balanced market.

> nvidia has an entire TEAM of people
> working on their driver, and they've got a lot more in the way of
> resources than we do. 
Yes! Since TEAM has docs. But how many they worry about Linux users?
I have a lot of negative reports from my friends that their drivers are
buggy and often hangup X11 systems. Important: I'd watched by my own eyes
their buggy video drivers. (Before purchasing my new video hardware I've
tested many cards. Yes! I'd used the latest drivers from their site).
All problems are excellently described in mplayer's documentation:
I agree with every its word.

Somewhere above (probably) you wrote that you have unstable system with
Radeon 8500. It simply broken chip and it's bad luck for you :( But you have
possibility to replace this chip with the same other.
In case of NVidia you have no possibility to improve their buggy drivers
and software. It it would be easy then why we have opensource competited
(IMPORTANT: The fact that you have working some 3D games under Linux
doesn't mean general stability of software. The same games you are able
to run on Radeon 8500 under Linux too).

> All I'm trying to get across is that nvidia shouldn't be villified for
> actually providing us with a product that works better than everybody
> elses. They have their reasons for keeping their software closed, and
But nobody vilified their. This subj has one goal is to tell to everyone
that NVidia is not good solution for opensource systems (due unstability,
proprietarity of its software and many other negative factors).

> despite that, they've given a lot more to the linux community in the
> way of credibility as an alternate platform than ATi has with their
> documentation. 
See above
> JS
> -- 
> ========================= jan at chloris.ca ========================
> Jan Sacharuk Member in Good Standing of The Discordian Solidarity
> Turn on viewing of the X-Geek-Code header to see my Geek Code
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>          And I descend from grace, in arms of undertow. 
>            I will take my place, in the great below.
>                    - "The Great Below", NIN
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Best regards! Nick

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